Forum Topic

Dear Amazon

You just sent me a gift voucher for fashion as the result of an order I placed.I doubt if I will use it but I thought anyhow I should give it back to you to help you pay your UK taxes - you obviously need the money!It's such a shame that a trusted brand like Amazon is undermining itself by not taking its responsibilities to its host nation seriously.Anything I can do to help - like returning your voucher and then talking about it of facebook, twitter and other social media, I will of course do.Good luckSara

Sara Nathan ● 5051d32 Comments

I'm with you on this. And while we are on the subject.... Starbucks are dead to me. I think its outrageous.

Richard Grange ● 5051d

Me too - but that's easy as their product is a) pretty nasty and b) easily substitutableWhereas I both liked and trusted Amazon and would prefer to continue to shop there. Not if their tax avoidance harms honourable places like John Lewis though.

Sara Nathan ● 5051d

While watching the debate on corporate tax on Question Time the other evening I was interested to learn that the majority of Starbucks outlets in the UK are franchises. For the uninitiated, this means they are owned by an independent retailer who pays a percentage of his/her profits to Starbucks in return for branding etc, but pays their own income tax. While in no way condoning Starbucks behaviour, I saw the fear on the faces of the franchisees in the audience and do hope that those of us who drink Starbucks coffee will  not necessarily stop doing so. What I am going to do about Amazon is quite another thing. Ideas anyone?

Maire Lowe ● 5051d

But it is an overall Starbucks problem as they inflate the costs of their compulsory supplies to franchises etc - adding about 15% "tax" that subsidiaries here have to pay to the European HQ in Brussels (I think but place unimportant) This means that it always looks like Starbucks costs are very high and diminishes their profits and therefore liabilities here. Yet it is a wholly artificial and totally within Starbucks control method of massaging the figures.And is outrageous.On AMAZON: I am only using them for books - not the things that threaten John Lewis. You can post whenever there is an Amazon thread on Facebook etc - not liking but saying how unhappy you are. You can email them every time you have a transaction and put your unhappiness into your rating.

Sara Nathan ● 5051d

I'm with you on this one too.  I use Amazon for when I can't get to the shops myself and want things more or less yesterday.  The type of books I buy too aren't normally available at bookshops in High Streets (and no, they're not porn books, well, maybe, if you saw me reading 50 Shades, but then, I got that from Sainsburys!!)I shall post my feedback on Amazon next time to include my thoughts about their taxation position.

Angela White ● 5050d

I'm happy to boycott Starbucks on the grounds (NPI) that their coffee is cr*p. Amazon is another matter. Just too inconvenient. I do buy things via them that John Lewis probably sell (most recently a microwave steamer) but where is the nearest John Lewis? Brent Cross? Too far!

Susan Kelly ● 5050d

Nearest JLP is at Westfield.

Peter Millman ● 5050d

Could do with a John Lewis at the Oaks, when it's redeveloped.  Would save having to go on line.  Anyway JL pay taxes.

Nicola Howard ● 5050d

** Nearest JLP is at Westfield.**Yes, the Stratford one not Shepherds Bush Westfield.

Ellie Rose ● 5050d

Actually, probably 2nd nearest John Lewis, after Brent Cross, is the one in Oxford Street.  3rd nearest is Watford.  All a  bit of a trek from Acton I'll agree.

David Lawes ● 5050d

But you can easily order from John Lewis online and their delivery is good.

Jill Williams ● 5050d

That's true. JL's delivery is good, but not free, like Amazon's, unless you're ordering megabucks.

Susan Kelly ● 5050d

But you can order from the John Lewis website and arrange to collect your order (if of appropriate size) from your nearest convenient branch of Waitrose. I've collected a new iron from West Ealing, and a laptop from Shepherds Bush Waitrose! And it's free.

Lorna Dodd ● 5050d

According to the Sunday Times today...Caffe Nero paid no corporation tax whatsoever last year on profits of £39.9 million made on its country-wide coffee chain’s total sales of £185.2 million.

Chris Martin ● 5049d

Cheeky baristas!

Keith Iddon ● 5049d

I'd love to boycott Amazon, but I have a Kindle. Can I download books from anywhere else?

Chris Hurley ● 5049d

Awful.  Shameful.

Angela White ● 5049d

Worth knowing, about the collection at Waitrose.

Susan Kelly ● 5049d

Criminal!What's wrong with a jar of Nescafe?

Nicola Howard ● 5049d

But they are not doing anything illegal, just looking after there shareholders which they have a duty to do. It's up to parliament to change the law.

Bob Crossley ● 5049d

I'm with parliament changing the law.I the meantime I will make sure that companies which I know avoid paying UK tax knows this damages their image and therefore their bottom line. There is such a thing as bad publicity (as Gerald ratner found out years ago ) and these companies are very protective of their brand image. If this damages it enough, they will change their ways.We nowadays decide what is acceptable in people with whom we do business. I think they are beginning to realise that.

Sara Nathan ● 5049d

John Lewis and M&S have excellent online services. I always look there first. Amazon sells on behalf of loads of small companies that wouldn't otherwise get online business.

Bob Crossley ● 5049d

Click and Collect free and orders over £50 free delivery - so not a total fortune.

Sara Nathan ● 5049d

OK - so it appears that Thames Water have also have paid no corporation tax while awarding themselves bonuses and providing a sub-standard service.So how do you boycott that? Stop drinking tap water? Avoid flushing the loo?I thought privatisation was supposed to introduce competition.

Richard Grange ● 4845d

I agreee with Bob. It's parliament you should be giving a hard time to, not those companies acting within the law.It's similar to saying it's bad form for all OAP's to accept winter fuel allowance if they are very wealthy, or for wealthy people over 80 to claim free TV licences - it may be true but you can't really blame them IMHO.Carl

Carl Tamboli ● 4845d

Am just relieved I was beaten in the last round to the rather jolly and lucrative role of NED at Thames by Ed - CEO of Ofcom and Deidre Hutton - the consumers' friend.That's what happens when you sup with Maquarrie!

Sara Nathan ● 4845d

That's privatisation with globalisation.

Philippa Bond ● 4844d

But sometimes the law is an ass.The reason companies like to say  "its not our fault, we are just obeying the law " is that what they know is that whatever Government does - very expensive tax lawyers can always find a loophole.What no company ever wants to address is the morality of not paying any tax - because deep-down they know they don't have a good answer.

Richard Grange ● 4844d

Richard, I would have thought that it wouldn't take the Inland Revenue very many years to analyse the tax avoided by these companies and to be in subsequent communication with the Treasury dept. Yes, the law can be an ass and yes there was a loophol.But how long is it acceptable for such a loophole to remain open for - that to me is the primary question  Ithink we should be looking at.Carl

Carl Tamboli ● 4844d

Hi CarlI think the problem is that it is incredibly difficult to create laws without any loopholes.And the situation hasn't been helped by HMRC staff - who know the system inside out and then leave and go and work for private sector companies. They can then guide those companies towards the loopholes in the law.The latest egregious example is Dave Hartnett - who ten months after leaving his top job at HMRC has gone to work to Deloitte. See belowhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2332364/ANDREW-PIERCE-Shameless-bungling--tax-boss-whos-sullied-civil-service.htmlTo tackle tax avoidance effectively you actually need a number of things - Government action, shareholder pressure, consumers voting with their feet  and companies that realise that they have a social as well as a financial duty.

Richard Grange ● 4844d

Fair response Richard.Carl

Carl Tamboli ● 4844d

I've done click and collect from Chiswick Waitrose.Also don't forget Peter Jones.  I work in Westminster so can get off the tube at Sloane Square and pop in on my way home.

Gill Hothersall ● 4843d